APNG-061-Draft.1

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MINUTES OF THE ASIA PACIFIC NETWORKING GROUP APNG-061-Draft.1

COMMERCIAL WORKING GROUP 1995.1.12

BEIJING MEETING, NOVEMBER, 1994 Bob Coggeshall

The ap-commercial meeting was held as part of the APNG meeting

at Tsinghua University in Beijing, PRC. Mr. Bob Coggeshall

(coggs@cogwheel.com) served as chair for the meeting.

Ms. Wendy Lin (wendylin@hk.super.net) recorded the minutes.

As this was the first meeting there was no previous business.

The following topics were taken up:

1) APNIC assistance models

2) Country/provider status

3) International leased circuit costs

4) Ap-commercial net presence

5) The travelling businessman plan

6) Housekeeping issues

7) Interexchage/Settlement concerns

1) APNIC ASSISTANCE MODELS

Mr David Conrad talked about APNIC funding. The APNIC is

made up of volunteers. It requires a budget to continue functioning

He proposed a scheme whereby APNIC would charge for network

address space. A routing registry which charged for routing table

space was also mentioned. Feedback was solicited.

Mr Wen Sung Chen proposed to charge the work load to each member

Mr Bob Coggshall proposed that PTTs and multinational telecommunications

with vested interest in rapid and orderly development of Internetworking]

in the region be approached for funding. He said he will try

to develop this proposal further and submit it to the group

for review.

Will discuss further by email

2) COUNTRY / PROVIDER STATUS REPORTS

(This took the largest amount of time with each presenter taking between

5 and 45 minutes. Future reports must be more strictly limited.)

1. Mr Thomas Agoston from IBM Japan

IBM global network will have dial up slip service in 15 countries in

1995. Already offer service in Australia, will go to New Zeland, Japan,

Hong Kong, etc.

2. Ms Ong Lai Kuen from Singapore Telecom

SingNet started commercial services in July 1994. They now have

1500 users, dial up only. Sin$ 35/mo, T1 to ANS in USA,

512k to the Singapore R&E network techNet. Will have PPP service

soon..

3. Mr Toshifumi Matsumoto from AT&T Jens (Japan)

ATT Jens started commmercial services in May 1993. They offer UUCP

and IP services. They have 250 UUCP customers, 150 IP customers.

AT&T in the USA is preparing to roll out some form of on-line service.

They may expand services in Hong Kong and AP area.

4. Mr Toru Takahashi from TokyoNet Services will be up in Dec. 94,

only doing dedicated and PPP type connections.

5. Mr Ben Chen from Sprint China

Sprint China will have two 64k from Beijing, Shanghai to SprintLink.

Their backbone is T3. They are assisting the PRC Ministry of Posts

and Telecommunications.

6. Ms Yu-Hsuan Chen from Taiwan Ministry of Education

There are three networks in the area - TANET, HINET, and SEEDNET.

All are for education and research users. TANET has 512k to US,

HINET has 64k to ANS in US.

7. Mr Aaron Cheung formerly of Hong Kong Internet & Gateway Services Ltd

now with Hong Kong Link Communications, Ltd.

HKIGS started services in Oct 1993. It has a 64K to ANS in US,

will be 128k in Jan. 1995. It has 22 leased line customers,

1,000+ dial up customers. A new provider, Hong Kong Link, will be

in service soon, with 128k to ANS in US and a flat rate charging

scheme of HK$288/mo.

8. Mr Tashiro Akira from InfoWeb Japan Offers leased line, dial up,

PPP and UUCP services.

9. Ms Wendy Lin from Hong Kong SuperNet

HK Supernet started services in Nov, 1993. It has a 64k to PSI in US.

A New 256k to Net99 in US will be installed at the end of Nov. 94.

6 dedicated customers, 1700 dial-up customers.

They offer shell accounts, SLIP/PPP and UUCP.

10. Mr Zhao Xiaofan from China UNICOM

Was founded four month agao, will provide Internet services.

They are free to compete with the MPT.

3) INTERNATIONAL LEASED CIRCUIT COSTS (ILCs)

Mr Bob Coggeshall explained that most AP Internet leased

data circuits go to the US because they are almost always

less expensive than links between non US countries. It was

concluded that this was due to market forces and agreements

set forth by the International Telecommunications Union and

without someone expert in such matters, there was not much

that our group could do to change things.

4) AP COMMERCIAL NET PRESENCE

Mr Bob Coggeshall raised the concern that the APNG documents

were not available in WWW form.

Mr Tommi Chen from offered to report back on what needed to be done.

5) JIN JO HUR's TRAVELLING BUSINESSMAN PLAN

Jin Jo Hur (jhhur@sol.inet.co.kr) who could not be at the meeting

asked Mr Bob Coggeshall to explain his proposal to make Internetworking

in Asia easier for the traveller by coordinating commercial providers

through a one-stop service which would let them obtain temporary

accounts with providers in all the countries they plan to be in.

6) HOUSEKEEPING ISSUES

In the light of the elections process of APNG being formalized,

Mr Bob Coggshall wished to emphasize that he was only the

*interim* coordinator of the ap-commercial WG.

Concerns were raised for the need to formalize APNG as it grows.

These concerns were passed on to the APNG chair at the

general meeting.

7) INTEREXCHANGE/SETTLEMENT CONCERNS

Mr Bob Coggeshall and Mr David Conrad gave their views on

current events within the Commercial Internet Exchange and its

impact on AP commercial providers. It was explained that

CIX membership was not mandatory, and that AP providers still had to

make transit agreements with USA backbone providers in any case.

In Japan and HK however, there are already providers who allow resale.

This obviates the need for one's own international leased circuit

and also an agreement with a USA backbone provider)

Mr Coggeshall proposed forming a consortium of AP commercial

providers to ensure settlement-free exchange among themselves

(except where sharing of bandwidth required it) and also

provide leverage when negotiating exchange agreements with other

global network and backbone operators.

ATTENDEES

matsumoto@spin.ad.jp Toshifumi Matsumoto AT&T Jens (Japan)

lkong@singnet.com.sg Ong Lai Kuen Singapore Telecom

aki@web.ad.jp Akira Tashiro Fujitsu (Japan)

ysuzuki@secom.sis.co.jp Yuichi Suzuki Secom Infon Systems (Japan)

tojo@surigiken.co.jp Tojo Iwao Surigiken Co., Ltd.(Japan)

ishida@u-tokyo.ac.jp Harushia Ishida University of Tokyo (Japan)

hdy@tsinghua.edu.cn Hu Daoyuan TsingHua University (PRC)

toru@interop.co.jp Toru Takahashi IAJ/Interop/TokyoNet

wendylin@hk.super.net Wendy Lin Hong Kong Supernet (HK)

liou@iiidns.iii.org.tw Albert Liou III (Taiwan)

candy@moersz.edu.tw Erin Chen TWNIC/MOE (Taiwan)

quan-ming@sprint.sprint.com Ben Chen Sprint China

ccykwok@cityu.edu.hk CY Kwok City Univ of Hong Kong

chehoocheng@cuhk.hk CH Cheng The Chinese Univ of HK

joel@ctsc.hkbu.edu.hk Joseph Leung HK Kong Baptist University

hcxchpt@hkucc.hku.hk PT Ho University of HK

tommi@technet.sg Tommi Chen Net Centre (S'pore)

agoston@vnet.ibm.com Tom Agoston IBM Global Networks Japan

aaron@hklink.net Aaron Ceung HK Link Communications

coggs@hk.super.net Bob Coggeshall Cogwheel Hong Kong.

Xiao Fan Zhao ChinaCom / Unicom (PRC)